Az utolsó interjú Martini bíborossal

Q: How do you see the situation of the Church?

A: The Church is tired, in prosperous Europe and in America. Our culture has grown old, our churches are large, our religious houses are empty and the bureaucratic apparatus of the church is becoming bloated, our rites and our garments are pompous. But do these things express what we are today? (...) Prosperity is a burden. We find ourselves there like the rich young man who went away sad when Jesus called him to become his disciple. I know that we cannot leave everything easily. But at least we could seek out men who are free and closer to their neighbors. As were Archbishop Romero and the Jesuit martyrs of El Salvador. Where among us are the heroes from whom we can draw inspiration? For no reason should we limit them with the bonds of the institution.

Q: Who can help the Church today?

A: Father Karl Rahner readily used the image of the coals that are hidden under the ashes. I see in the Church of today so much ash on top of the coals that I am often assailed by a sense of powerlessness. How can the coals be freed from the ashes so as to reinvigorate the flame of love? First of all, we must seek out these coals. Where are the individual persons full of generosity like the good Samaritan? Who have faith like the Roman centurion? Who are enthusiastic like John the Baptist? Who have a daring for novelty like Paul? Who are faithful like Mary Magdalene? I advise the pope and the bishops to seek out twelve persons not of the common mold for managerial positions. Men who are close to the poorest and who are surrounded by young people and who experience new things. We are in need of encounter with men who burn in such a way that the spirit may spread everywhere.

Q: What tools do you recommend against the weariness of the Church?

A: I recommend three that are very powerful. The first is conversion: the Church must recognize its own errors and must undertake a radical journey of change, beginning with the pope and the bishops. The scandals of pedophilia drive us to undertake a journey of conversion. The questions about sexuality and about all of the topics that involve the body are an example of this. These are important for everyone, and at times they may even be too important. We must ask if the people still listen to the counsels of the Church in sexual matters. Is the Church still an authority of reference in this area, or only a caricature in the media? The second [is] the Word of God. Vatican Council II gave the Bible back to Catholics. (...) Only those who perceive this word in their hearts can be part of those who will assist the renewal of the Church and be able to respond to personal questions with a correct decision. The word of God is simple, and seeks as companion a heart that listens. (...) Neither the clergy nor ecclesial law can replace the interiority of man. All of the external rules, the laws, the dogmas are given to us in order to clarify the internal voice and for the discernment of spirits. For whom do the sacraments exist? These are the third instrument of healing. The sacraments are not an instrument for discipline, but an aid for men in the moments of the journey and in the weaknesses of life. Do we take the sacraments to men who require new strength? I am thinking of all of the divorced and of remarried couples, of expanded families. These have need of special protection. The Church upholds the indissolubility of marriage. It is a grace when a marriage and a family succeed (...) Our attitude toward the expanded family will determine to what extent the generation of children approaches the Church. A woman has been abandoned by her husband and finds a new companion who takes care of her and her three children. The second love is a success. If this family is discriminated against, it is not only the woman who is left out, but also her children. If the parents feel themselves outside of the Church or do not feel its support, the Church will lose the future generation. Before communion, we pray: "Lord, I am not worthy..." We know that we are not worthy. Love is a grace. Love is a gift. The question of whether the divorced can receive communion must be turned around. How can the Church, with the power of the sacraments, come to the aid of those who have complex family situations?

Q: What are you doing personally?

A: The church is 200 years behind. Why in the world does it not rouse itself? Are we afraid? Fear instead of courage? In any case, faith is the foundation of the Church. Faith, trust, courage. I am old and sick, and I depend on the help of others. Good people around me make me feel love. This love is stronger than the sentiment of distrust that I sometimes perceive toward the Church in Europe. Only love overcomes weariness. God is love. I have another question for you: what can you do for the Church?

(From "Corriere della Sera" of September 1, 2012)